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HBO: Did you know much about Barry Goldwater
when you came to this project?
Julie Anderson: No. All I knew was that Barry Goldwater
didn't sign the Civil Rights Act, and nobody I
knew liked him. So when I signed on to this
project, I'd tell my friends, I'm directing a
documentary about Barry Goldwater. And
there would be this pause, like, really? But
as I got into the project and learned more
about him, I realized that it really is time to go
back and look at Barry Goldwater.
Because now everybody's so involved with
raising money for their campaigns and trying
to get every last vote that they're so
milquetoast. No one wants to take a stand on
anything. And then when they do the
population turns against them. Then they
change their minds. And Barry would never
have changed his mind. He always stood for
what he believed was right and no one could
rock his internal integrity.
HBO: In many ways Goldwater 'rocked' the system,
even within his own party.
Julie Anderson: Well, he had always been a Republican. He
came to national prominence initially based
on his book, The Conscience of a Conservative.
After that the Republicans decided he was a
voice they could put out there, and that he
could get elected, they got behind him and
convinced him to run for President. His
political ideology was completely in line with
the Republican party back then. In fact, he
defined conservatism for the Republican
party.
But when the Reagan years began and the
Moral Majority started having a voice, Barry -
who stood where he had always stood, who
believed in the separation of church and
state, who believed in the individual taking
care of him or herself - felt that the federal
government had no business telling people
what they should believe in terms of their
religion, had no business telling people
whether or not they should or could have an
abortion.
And in the Eighties he really split from the
Republican party because he didn't change.
The Republican party moved into a different
place. And he would have seen this party as
not the definition of conservatism. In fact, it's
completely unlike what he had stood for.
HBO: If you didn't know better, you might think he
was like Reagan, or the current Bush.
Julie Anderson: And he's completely not. At the end of his
political career the Republican party basically
asked him to step aside, which he wasn't
ready to do. They felt like his time on the
national stage had passed - meaning, he does
not support what we support, and so we need
to not have him be our voice anymore.
HBO: He's famous for comments like "Extremism in
the pursuit of liberty is no vice," and, of
course, for the fact that he didn't sign the
Civil Rights Act.
For me, coming into this film as the director, I
knew it would be my job to make sure we did
a balanced picture of Barry Goldwater, that it
would not be a love letter to Barry from his
grand-daughter; that it had to be more than
that. So it was important to look at the
reasons people did not like Barry Goldwater.
It was important to get voices in there from an
Al Franken and a Julian Bond and a James
Carville. It was important to have people like
that who could say, At that time I thought he
was a raving lunatic.
We had to explain why Barry did not vote for
the Civil Rights Act, which when you parse it
down to his politics you understand why:
because he didn't feel like that was something
the federal government should regulate.
For me, that felt like a place where he should
have allowed his moral judgment to override
his political judgment, which he didn't, which
is why people were so angry with him at that
time.
And when we approached Al Franken and
James Carville, I think they felt the same way
I did. It was like, Why are you asking me to
talk about Barry Goldwater? But in essence
their voices are so interesting because they
did not support him at a time for very smart
reasons. And yet both of them still admire
and respect him now. And James Carville
even says that he wouldn't do this for any
Republican Senator, meaning sit down and do
an interview.
HBO: Goldwater and Kennedy had a novel idea,
before JFK's assassination, about chartering a
plane and traveling together during the '64
election.
Julie Anderson: He and Kennedy, ironically, were very good
friends, even though they were in conflicting
parties. Barry was the kind of guy who could
disagree with you politically and then go drink
bourbon with you and have a great time.
And he and Kennedy started joking about this
idea when they were going to run against each
other in the '64 election. They said what we
should do is charter a plane and basically
grandstand all over the country and land and
debate each other in front of an audience, and
discuss our politics and discuss what we
believe and explain what we disagree with
each other about. And it was going to be very
civilized and it would have been fascinating.
But then, of course, Kennedy was shot and all
that went down the drain when it turned out
that he would run against Johnson, because
Johnson hated Goldwater.
HBO: It's interesting to think how that might have
shaped the future of politics had they been
able to do that.
Julie Anderson: It is interesting. Had they been able to, would
they have changed the way Presidential
candidates approach a Presidential election?
Had they campaigned across from each other
at every campaign stop, then this whole deal
with debates and the formulaic quality it now
has - we wouldn't have that. We would have
open debate, which is what Barry wanted.
Because he knew he could stand up for what
he believed in, and he wasn't afraid to be
asked any question.
HBO: What are hoping HBO audiences take away
from the film?
Julie Anderson: Well, part of the reason we're putting the
movie on now in September is because we're
coming up on mid-term elections. We're
putting it on early enough in the season when
all these elections are heating up. And
hopefully people who look at this film will
really think about the people they vote for -
whether they're Republican or Democratic.
It's really important to see what your
candidates stand for before you deliver your
vote. And I think this film will help you think
deeply about that, looking beyond what is
smoke and mirrors, or hair and makeup, or
thirty second commercials, to really see what
your candidates believe.
The other challenge, and what I hope will
come across to audiences, was to make it
relevant. C.C. Goldwater had brought us this
project thinking that she was going to do this
historical film about her grandfather's life.
But as we listened to CC's stories - and if you
look at C.C., she's just full of charisma - it
was clear that we had to put C.C. in the
movie. She had to tell the story.
So, when she's telling you a story about her
grandfather running for President and she's
five, she tells you stories from her point of
view. She really gives you this view of what it
was like then, rather than reminisce back or a
revisionist history. She really talks about
what a five year old thought, what a seven
year thought; what a twelve year old thought.
And I think it gives the film a real richness it
otherwise wouldn't have had.
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