HBO
You have done films about Deep Throat, Tammy Faye Baker, Monica Lewinsky,
Anna Nicole and now Heidi Fleiss. Is there a theme or a certain type of subject you are
drawn to?
Randy Barbato
We are often attracted to people who we think we know -- people
who are in the media spotlight in a way that you think you have seen everything you can
see, and heard everything you can hear about them. But often it's those people who we
know the least about.
HBO
How did you come to cover Heidi's story?
Randy Barbato
Really, the hook for this film was meant to be the building of her brothel in Crystal,
Nevada. We were very interested just purely from a character study perspective and
understanding a really interesting personality. But we also thought, "Oh, here is a great
narrative arc." This film will start with the breaking of ground and hopefully it'll end
with a ribbon cutting ceremony - and who knows, maybe even a big dance number with a
bunch of male studs. Obviously it didn't end up that way...
HBO
Did you have any inklings or expectations of any of the other issues she faced
when you were going in?
Randy Barbato
We knew we were dealing with someone who had been through rough times; who
had survived a stint in prison; who had previously had issues with drug addiction. So we
weren't completely naïve; we knew we were dealing with someone complex. We did
not expect to find someone who was going through as tough a time as she was when we
were filming. That did take us by surprise and it had a huge impact on the film that we
ultimately made.
HBO
Was there a certain point where you got worried you had to change the course of
the story? How did that work?
Randy Barbato
The reality is, when you are making virtually any documentary film, you imagine it
in your mind. At times, you even create an outline. You pre-produce in your mind what
this film will be. And then you get the camera in your hand and you throw everything
out. Sometimes you are able to keep some of the ideas intact. It changes with every
project. With this film virtually every pre-conceived notion of what we thought this film
should be, we had to throw out the window. The one thing I would say that this film still
has...that inspired us to make the film at the beginning...is just an incredibly compelling
character. She is smart, she is funny. She is a bit of all the things that we imagined. The
only difference is that, while we were making this film, she was struggling with the
disease of addiction.
You know, people set out to make films about addiction on a regular basis. But to see
someone talk about it in a sober way and then live her life in what might be perceived as
a not-so-sober way...it's not fun when you are in the field making it, but it's pretty
compelling to see.
HBO
Do you ever have conflicts when you are making your films about wanting to
intervene with the subject's life?
Randy Barbato
Our style of filmmaking is that we try to immerse ourselves in the subject's world as
much as possible. We try to experience and look at the world and take it in the way our
subject is. A lot of times, that's great, it's fabulous; you are immersing yourself in some
fabulous person's world. But if they are truly experiencing a difficult and challenging
and at times dark time...then it becomes a whole other experience. There were incredible
highs and incredible lows. And a lot of time waiting. We have spent a lot of time at the
Days Inn in Pahrump, Nevada. And let me tell you, it's no Bellagio.
HBO
It seemed like Heidi cleaned up for that one more formal interview about 10
months into it. Were you involved in that decision, or in her trying to get sober at that
point?
Randy Barbato
Look, we had a lot of soundbites and audio from Heidi that would tell the kind of
story we needed to tell. But there is just no way that this film would connect to people
without that kind of an interview. We needed that. We were at a point in the film where
we were shut out of our subject's life; she refused to work with us. Sheila Nevins
conducted that interview. In the film, you see a number of people that we witness come
into her life and get shut out -- you see Michael get shut out. Literally, that was gonna
happen - no matter what - from day one. So we were just waiting for that to happen to us,
and eventually it did.
HBO
You use a lot of imagery in your filmmaking. When in the process do you decide
on those elements, and how do you choose them?
Randy Barbato
Everything is inspired by the subject: All the images, everything. A lot of it we
decide as we are putting the film together, as we are in the edit room, as we are listening
to things she said. That's where it all comes from. Some of it is stuff that we already shot;
some of it is stuff that we literally set up in shoots, like the birdcages. There were a lot
of metaphors going on and a lot of possibilities of visual motif that we kept seeing -- like
birds in cages and her in prison.
If we had tried to write this story, no one would believe it. You know: a bedridden former
Madam who collects exotic birds...who dies and leaves the birds to Heidi. Come on.
And I remember the first day meeting Maryanne, and seeing the way Heidi looked at the
birds, and I just thought "Oh my God, really, this is the story - and this is the film."
HBO
How would you describe your style or influences?
Randy Barbato
Our style is all about the subject. I think that we are versatile documentary
filmmakers. We are not "old school," we are not "purists," we are not particularly
objective. [LAUGHS] We make films that aim straight for the heart. We are all about
trying to understand misunderstood people. The number one thing is just for us to listen.
We listen to what people are saying. And we watch what they are doing. And everything
we do is inspired by that. We are not precious about filming a prop or recreation. We are
not precious about any of that because everything is inspired by trying to understand our
subject; by their words; by what we are feeling; by just...trying to get into their head
and their heart.
HBO
There's this idea with documentaries that they are "more balanced" or "objective"
or "real" than fiction because they are true.
Randy Barbato
Here is the thing. Truth is stranger than fiction.
And truth inspires all fiction. Everyone who wants to tell a story - every movie that's
made, every book that's written, whether the story is based on truth or not, everyone is
trying to recreate something real. Recreate a real emotion. Recreate a real feeling.
Recreate a real character. In that sense, documentaries always have one-up on all those
other forms, because you have the opportunity to get the real deal right there, right in
front of your eyes. But sometimes people get it wrong, [LAUGHS] you know? Pointing
the camera and just shooting it at something real does not make a great documentary.